35. On Good Risk, Lifestyle Design, & Courage to Step Off the Path with Mike Murgatroyd
Overview
In this episode, I’m joined by my good friend, Mike Murgatroyd. Mike is one of the people I talk to and love to seek wisdom from when making decisions about my own life and career. He’s supported me in finding my way towards more Sustainable Ambition. So, I wanted to have him on to hear more about his own journey and how he makes decisions about his career and life.
It’s not been an easy journey for Mike to find fulfilling work, continually fighting the need to be responsible and have security balanced with his desire to grow and learn. Mike is an early entrepreneur who has over time learned to dance with risk and define “good risk” to finally become an entrepreneur later in his career. Beyond career, Mike shares his philosophies and approach to lifestyle design and how for him work and personal life aren’t separate. He sees life as a “series of projects” and the integration of both being what allows him to sustain himself.
In Mike being open and sharing his story, I hope you find inspiration to get to know yourself and build the courage (as Mike shares in his final piece of advice) to consider taking a divergent path if that “path less taken” is calling you. As Mike said: “Have the courage to go out there and create an extraordinary life for yourself and those that you love, whatever that is to you.” And: “That’s the goal—it is to spend our time and not pass it.”
I knew I’d love this conversation, and I did! Thank you for being on and sharing your journey with us, Mike!
More about Our Guest
Mike Murgatroyd is Co-founder and President of Van Evolve, which brings the very best in Adventure Vans and Adventure Van components to the U.S. so you are ready for adventure, anytime, anywhere. Prior to starting his entrepreneurial ventures, Mike spent his career in CPG with companies such as P&G, Clorox, and White Wave Foods. He was also a brand management consultant specializing in innovation for companies such as Beyond Meat, Earthbound Farm, and Goodbelly. Mike has an MBA from the University of Michigan and an undergraduate business degree from the University of Virginia. Mike is also a husband and proud father of two fabulous boys.
Topics Covered
We start by covering where Mike grew up and went to college, what he studied, and where he started his career. Not the only one to be drawn to Wall Street after seeing the 80’s movie of the same name, Mike was not just driven by money but also, as we learn later in the conversation, by a deep-seeded understanding of needing to be responsible for taking care of himself.
You’ll hear how Mike always had an entrepreneurial spirit, and after a stint on Wall Street and another corporate gig, he was called to San Francisco and the dot com boom, San Francisco’s second gold rush, of sorts. Yet, after the bust, he didn’t hear the entrepreneurial calling and felt like he had lost his way.
At that moment, he found himself going back to business school as a restart and a plan B (not too unusual to hear from others who land in business school or who end up getting a masters degree).
And if you’re like Mike and are drawn towards entrepreneurship but are also risk averse, heed his advice that you need to “kick down the door to entrepreneurship.” It’s not going to present itself nice and neatly and without any risk.
Mike shares how despite his deep-seated desire to be an entrepreneur, he was attracted to professional opportunities that presented themselves. Yet, he’d often get bored over time.
One of the things that is common, yet people might overlook is how networking with others can point you towards career possibilities. You don’t know what’s out there if you haven’t gotten exposure to different paths. That’s how Mike learned about brand management in consumer packaged goods companies; he talked to someone who was a year ahead of him at his banking job who was currently working at P&G and could tell him what the role was like and how it might be a good fit for him. He decided to give it a try, another important concept when managing one’s career, especially when you’re still finding your way.
You’ll hear throughout the conversation that over the course of Mike’s career, he’s thought a lot about and danced with managing risk. He reminds us that “risk taking is a practice.” Mike shares how he thinks about risk and what he calls “good risk.”
“Understand what good risk is and embrace good risk. All risk is not created equally. And risk is a fantastic part of the portfolio that allows you to live an extraordinary life, whatever that means to you.”
How to manage risk? Mike would say get smart and then trust your gut.
We talk about the concept of lifestyle design and talk with Mike about his 10-year plan towards retirement. The idea of the 10-year plan came out of the experience Mike had working in corporate environments where he just didn’t feel like he fit and it wasn’t satisfying. The corporate environment didn’t allow him to operate the way he preferred. The ten year plan was a way for him to manage risk; it was a low risk plan that would allow him to be free. What did he learn? That it was false safety and ignored one of the elements that drives him most—growth. In sticking to this risk-averse plan, what he found was that he likely passed up opportunities that could have been a better fit for him.
His advice on the other side? Consider taking a pause to stop and listen to yourself, and dig for the courage to take a divergent path and take that risk.
“There’s so much pressure when you go through this business school route to craft a resume that doesn’t have gaps, that has the right jobs and the right stops. It can lead to a fulfilling life for some, but for me that was a real clenched up way to be. And trying to adhere to a script that was made for many but not for me was difficult, because then I wasn’t paying heed to the true opportunities, and maybe where I could really spread my wings.”
We come back to lifestyle design, and Mike shares how he frames lifestyle design, the buckets that are important—something to do, something to love, and something to hope for—and to frame that across goals, people, and activities. And he notes how it is important to know oneself and be intentional in decisions you make. For Mike, he doesn’t see the distinction between work and life. Rather, he sees “life as a series of projects.” That’s becoming a theme here on the podcast.
“I think purposely with life man needs something to do, something to love, and something to hope for. And those things should all be tied together. If they are, you’re going to enjoy what you’re doing on a meta level. And if you enjoy what you’re doing, you’re going to be doing your best, you’re going to be able to grow the most, create the most, and add the most to society.”
“Lifestyle design is very important. So a 360 degree look at what do I need to do to be happy? What is the balance of it all—the balance being the thing that really seems to be important to make me tick.”
Mike shares how he sustains himself and how all that he has in his life—professional and personal—fuels each side. It’s not one or the other. All of it together sustains him.
Mike’s final piece of advice: “Have the courage to go out there and create an extraordinary life for yourself and those that you love, whatever that is to you. Because extraordinary is different to everybody. It’s not this idea of elite or what have you. It is what’s really honoring you—what is enabling you to grow, what is enabling you to be your best for you, for your friends, your family, and for the world as a whole.”
Resources Mentioned
Find Mike at his company, Van Evolve: https://www.vanevolve.com/
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35. On Good Risk, Lifestyle Design, & Courage to Step Off the Path with Mike Murgatroyd
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